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Forum » Server's » [AMG] GTi MotorSport » GTi Tutorial (GTi Tutorial)
GTi Tutorial
rageshgrDate: Sunday, 2011-10-16, 10:55 PM | Message # 1
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Now I am realising what Sin meant the other day when he said GTi is fun. After a long hard day of hot racing at the GTR track :P, there is nothing better to unwind than to race in GTi server. Those cute little cubs of cars puts smile on my face. You are not nervous as you are on GTR, due to the low speeds involved. These cars esp XFG do not upset or get suspension damage if hit slightly. So everything is cool.

Coming to my post, I was wondering if stalwarts like Smoke or Sin can teach how to drive in XFG/BL1 like you have the FXR/AS3 tutorial. I try to drive exactly like the 1:33 guys and end up clocking a 1:36 or 1:37 and end up looking like a fool wink One thing I learnt is, break as little as possible so that you don't lose momentum, coz given the acceleration of these cars momentum is all you can count on. Anyone can chip in with more advice?


Message edited by rageshgr - Sunday, 2011-10-16, 11:07 PM
 
SinDate: Monday, 2011-10-17, 0:49 AM | Message # 2
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I think this is one for SMOKE , i can do 34's in the XFG there but i'm losing time in the 3rd sector somewhere ... i also need more practice as i rarely race there atm sad

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rageshgrDate: Monday, 2011-10-17, 1:34 AM | Message # 3
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Thanks Sin, yeah Smoke is the BL hero smile
 
[SMOKE]Date: Tuesday, 2011-10-18, 0:33 AM | Message # 4
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Hey there buddy, sorry it took me so long to respond - haven't been on here in a few days or so. Some of the tips I'm gonna give are gonna sound pretty darn basic and aren't going to apply to you - but don't be offended, I just want to make sure I cover all subjects.
: Make sure you have good equipment / don't use keyboard for example. If you have a wheel, be sure it's set for gti cars and not still gtr cars. For example: In your profiler - 720 rotation for gti cars, and 720 in lfs control options, and be sure to go ahead and do the Axes FF callibration thing again , center and then lock it - just in case. Set the FFB where you feel enough for gti cars (different than gtr cars) mine is 35FFB in-game, 102 overall in profiler, 0 on other profiler effects, allow game to adjust. Be sure not to use auto transmission of course, as it's too slow. You CAN use autoclutch, but autoclutch off is a tad faster most say, I think it is also. But the difference there is very small. If you do turn autoclutch off - go with 10 on button control rate. Even make sure your field of view and display settings are right for the gti cars - little things are different than gtr cars. At amg gti you should use at least 7% fuel for 5 laps, I like 8 for the occasional extra lap or whatever. Make sure you have a solid collection of setups from only the best AMG GTI racers - you'd be surprised how many people do so much better with a setup they never thought they would need to try - try as many as you can. I recommend Pascal or Stiggy for XFG, Pascal is for when you are really good allready, and stiggy is for when you're not perfect yet. XRG set's I recommend Trismo or Storm (but I'm not an XRG guy so much) On the green light start - I find that I get the best launch everytime by holding the clutch - rev all the way at the last second, then release and upshift at redline from 1st to 2nd, and 2nd to 3rd - then at 7500 for the whole rest of the race. you should get at least 6.5 on takeoff everytime. If you've got all that covered - the last step is the way you drive: I will only speak about XFG here - it's what I know: Momentum, and finding just the right time to let-off the brake in a way that will start to send the available traction back to steering - and your steering should be close to center when this occurs - then gentle timely steering "sugestion" towards the goal on the other side of the apex - with the apex just being part of the path along the way there, and counter steer in S-turn early enough towards that track out spot (just don't get too deep in the grass at that apex unless you're in XRG). you have to watch what the hood of the car is doing if it's starting to pitch into the turn then don't brake anymore and don't get on the throttle until you feel it's sufficiently pitching towards the goal point. then freeze your steering angle and full gas (This technique is only used when you are in the 1:33.90 or better range of momentum) Also spec your favorite AMG GTI heroes in action from the viewpoint you drive in with the gas and brake display gauges on and pay CLOSE attention to EXACTLY when they brake, etc. Also watch them from the overhead view way up high - skycam - with the racing line ON, and you'll see exactly how it's done.

Added (2011-10-18, 0:33 Am)
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A lot of GTR guys mess themselves up by forgetting to change their steering rotation to GTi cars, if your rotation is less than 720 - you're hurting yourself. Because you'll be steering too "jerky" and quickly in a car that wants to lose it's momentum with every input you make. A perfect XFG lap would be one in which you never steer left or right at all lol - Seriously - you only want to steer jjjjjuuussttt enough and no more! Or else you'll find yourself understeering because you're steering too jerky, or too far, or too long. The more steering input you give the XFG - the more understeer you get. Of course you must make sure you are grazing each apex and track out point - but don't drive in a way that has you steering more than 90 degrees or so for ANY BL1 turn in XFG. Even the hairpin only needs 90 at most (left hand on top ~ right hand on bottom). More than this is just gonna make the traction to the front tires dissappear. Listen for the sound of tires squeiling - if they are, then you're loosing speed. they will make some sound of course - but you get the idea. 720 is the native lock to lock of the XFG for a reason - Serious

 
rageshgrDate: Tuesday, 2011-10-18, 0:50 AM | Message # 5
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Smoke, awesome tutorial. Thanks for taking time to write such great details. I will try to apply them. I know wheel is better but my whee does n't have Force feedback, I like keyboard, I am trying to be a standout and try using keyboard all the way(That does n't mean I won't shift to wheel if I decide to buy a good one). I got to 1.8% of WR on FXR using keyboard. Which means if I could do a 1:34.5 at GTI, I would be more than pleased smile (I know 1:34.5 is snail pace :P)

My hero as of now is JAVIER318, he has a 1:33.5 with a keyboard. So I got setup from him. I also got setup from Wayne, Sin, coffee cup, kripton and loquila. I will now go and get sets from Stiggy. Good tip on the steer lock at the S-bend I too observed that they get the perfect line and lock the steering after turn1. I will try button control rate 10 now. Very good suggestion on the launch. I do find that guys are quicker than me at launch. Probably they are using ur technique. I have my pedals dispay on as when I observe I like to observe when they brake as well. Main problem I have is the car is swaying like it is windy, that is probably because I am on KB.

Thanks for all the tip SMOKE, I will try them right away.


Message edited by rageshgr - Tuesday, 2011-10-18, 0:51 AM
 
[SMOKE]Date: Tuesday, 2011-10-18, 1:02 AM | Message # 6
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Of course there'll be some guy who comes on here and says: "I can get 33's with 270 rotation" Or: "I can get 33's with steering more than that" or whatever - But then again there are probably those who can play the guitar with their toes - doesn't mean I'd advise doing it that way. The reason I say 720 is because If you woke up tomorrow and a real life XFG was parked in your driveway - it would have 720 rotation - that's just how they made it. And when you steer exactly an inch in a direction - the front wheel should also move THAT amount. But if you're at 270 for example - even if it's set to wheel turn compensation at 1.00 (which it allways should be), when the 270 rotation guy turn his wheel that same inch - the tires are turning much further to compensate for a smaller lock to lock - which means you aren't able to make the same minute delicate adjustment that the guy with 720 can make. And when an inch of steering is the difference between a 29.80 1st split and a 30.30 1st split - It does matter. Also about the setups = Try as many as you can. There was a time when I thought I would never need to use a setup other than the Pascal setup - Then I tried Stiggy's for fun - I WAS AMAZED - It was so much better for me I thought I was cheating somehow! So definately try multiple setups.

Added (2011-10-18, 0:56 Am)
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Just saw your post = Glad to hear your using Javier's set, he's a good man I like racing him. Also those other sets are mostly good too. I have the stiggy for you when you see me if you see me first. Also, 33.5 is cool for keys - it's gonna be sooo hard though! I wish I could buy you a wheel - I don't envy all the hard work ahead of you - but it'll be that much sweeter when you reach your goal I guess. And I know you will. Let me know if there's ever anything I can do for ya buddy. I'll be cheering for you!

Added (2011-10-18, 1:01 Am)
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Here's the Stiggy set

Added (2011-10-18, 1:02 Am)
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Well I attached file - stiggy set - then posted - but don't see it. hmm.. not sure..

 
SinDate: Tuesday, 2011-10-18, 2:34 AM | Message # 7
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Theres a limit on the size of file that users can add i'm afraid , but as i have it i shall add it here good

P.S. thanks for the tutorial , i'm gonna try to better my 2nd and 3rd sectors now biggrin
Attachments: XFG_BL1_StiggyS.set(0.1 Kb)


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rageshgrDate: Friday, 2011-10-21, 9:20 PM | Message # 8
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Hey Thanks Smoke so sweet of you, yes I will get in touch with you if I need anything else. My bad dude, I didn't do enough research abt force feedback and bought a small 20 cm non-force feedback wheel. Seriosusly my keyboard gives me better feedback than this wheel. Or may be I am wrong, I need more practice with wheel. May be I am impatient that I am about 2% slower with the wheel than with the keyboard as of now. One more bad news, this wheel has only 270 lock lock, so as u said I cant get the one-one to realistic mapping between my wheel and the car wheel. I am hoping to buy a DFG or atleast a sidewinder in the near future. Atleast till then its KB. Thanks for the encouragement SMOKE, yes it is gonna be really sweet when I reach my goal. the bigger the challenge the more the satisfaction smile

Thanks Sin for the set! smile and thanks once again for making me LIMAD2, I will discharge my duties to the best of my abilities. SMOKE, here we go, let's make this place cleaner and fairer smile

Added (2011-10-21, 9:20 PM)
---------------------------------------------

Quote (|SMOKE|)
But the difference there is very small. If you do turn autoclutch off - go with 10 on button control rate.


Hey dude I discovered that the button control rate (bcr) does not affect the clutch. Irrespective of whether you set to manual cluctch or auto clutch. I set BCR to 2.00 and saw that the accl and brake pedals move very slowly but clutch moves very fast same as BCR 10. So guess it applies only for accl, brake and handbrake
 
[SMOKE]Date: Saturday, 2011-10-22, 1:35 AM | Message # 9
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Interesting stuff, I'll have to look into that. Yeah, I only just started doing the clutch work the other day so I'm not up to speed on this subject, I even made a thread for it in case anybody has any tips for me. The button control rate of 10 was based on advice I was given by TOTO and CamelClubR.
 
SinDate: Saturday, 2011-10-22, 2:39 AM | Message # 10
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I don't use it so its wasted on me lol wink

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PectoRisDate: Monday, 2013-04-29, 9:36 PM | Message # 11
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Quote ([SMOKE)
]Momentum, and finding just the right time to let-off the brake in a way that will start to send the available traction back to steering - and your steering should be close to center when this occurs - then gentle timely steering "sugestion" towards the goal on the other side of the apex


secret is in here, the point when and how you let of the brake, in such a way that you steer the car with brake and keeping momentum with letting go the brake and hitting apex, with perfect timing ofcourse (if that makes any sense to anyone), when you do it you will know what i mean smile
great explanation btw smoke smile
 
[SMOKE]Date: Monday, 2013-04-29, 10:32 PM | Message # 12
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Thanks buddy! I still couldn't explain it as good as I wanted, but I'm glad it made sense anyways. Hehehe
Oh, and another thing I should've put in there was T1:
For XFG on T1, brake at the beginning of the curbing and be aiming for the outside point past the first clipping point so that at the end of it you allmost go out to the grass. Then you're bringing it back in towards the chicane and you strattle over the first curb-bump, then immediately bring it back left and shift to 3rd. Bring this left turn arc just enough so that you allmost pick up sand on your left tires but try to avoid that. Then for the final part you want to start unwinding the wheel as soon as possible, and strattle over the curb-bump here as well (you might need to turn your front tires to the right at the moment you hit the curb-bump so that they drive over the bump rather than clash into the bump making the car want to roll, but let the car list out to the left side of the track rather than pinching off the momentum). The sooner you get out of your chicane's left turn and begin your straitening up for the straitaway - the faster the split will be. The whole thing from starting to brake for T1 to unwinding out to the left of the straitaway and going into 4th - all of that needs to be done by using as much of the track surface as possible  - increasing the radius of the arcs as much as possible. And you'll want your entry braking and big swing around to be done in a way so that it's hard to tell when the car is done braking and when it's starting to accelerate. You want the braking into acceleration transition to be as smooth and seemless as possible. Remember: you're not stopping, and then going. You're slowing while going.
The fastest 1st split I've ever done was a 29.80 - But to get better results you'll eventually want to turn autoclutch off if you haven't allready. With autoclutch off and if you heel n toe a bit, you can shorten the braking zone and get 29.7x like Trismo. I still can't do that, I still avg only 29.97 - 30.00 because I drive with autoclutch on. Everytime I turn autoclutch off I only get around 30.12 because I'm not able to move my wheel smoothly with where my clutch button is and it's a bit awkward for me still. As I reach for the clutch button for each downshift and upshift - it restricts the smoothness of my hand movement. And the smooth and sure movements at the wheel are more important to your speed than manually clutching. If I kept at it until it became natural to reach for that button while turning my wheel and got used to it... I'd be faster. But at this point since I'm faster with autoclutch on - I just leave it on.


Message edited by [SMOKE] - Monday, 2013-04-29, 10:46 PM
 
rageshgrDate: Tuesday, 2013-04-30, 4:56 AM | Message # 13
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Wow! the expert going over the nuances. great tutorial SMOKE!
 
[SMOKE]Date: Tuesday, 2013-04-30, 5:20 AM | Message # 14
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Allways glad to help buddy - I love you guys and I want to see everyone have their time to shine! AMG ftw! We gotta stick together and remember that we're a family. We're brothers.. AMG = the best in the business, but there's so much more potential in AMG's demo theater of operations - the sky's the limit if we devote ourselves. We're allready the most respected name in LFS demo servers, especially since the creation of AMG GTi Prosports - we just need to come together as a team in the demo arena the way AMG represented itself in the S2 arena. Then we'll be legendary in the world of LFS if we're not allready.. we need all AMG members to focus up and get active and show the LFS demo world what excellence looks like.

Message edited by [SMOKE] - Tuesday, 2013-04-30, 5:25 AM
 
PectoRisDate: Tuesday, 2013-04-30, 11:24 AM | Message # 15
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but you still need to learn how to drive xrg biggrin
wayne said he will learn xrg when he beats your time, i think he already did, it would be a perfect time to teach you both wink biggrin
btw can you just buy different pedals? its easier if you have 3 pedals
 
[SMOKE]Date: Tuesday, 2013-04-30, 7:52 PM | Message # 16
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Heeheehee, Wayne wishes he beat my time! I'm 1:33.40, and he's 1:33.41. I'm allways just a little faster than him - I got my 1:33.40 when he was still at 1:33.50  - over the past 4 months he's slowly caught up to my .40 allmost - but he's still .01 behind. I hope he does beat my time, I'm chearing for him! As for XRG driving - yeah it's something I plan to begin once I peak out my XFG abilities, but that won't be for another few years. I'm gonna have to buy a new wheel soon as this my 3rd, is getting worn out. I think my next wheel might be a G27 or a Thrustmaster T500.. We'll see. If I started working on the XRG now - it would take away from my progress with the XFG and I don't want that. I'm hoping to get as close to 1:32's with my XFG driving as possible before I move to another car category.

Added (2013-04-30, 7:52 PM)
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I just got a new pb! 1:33.39  I'm gonna make the youtube video and post a link to it on the forum under AMG GTI videos or whatever that thread is.. Seeya soon!

 
PectoRisDate: Thursday, 2013-05-02, 12:54 PM | Message # 17
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i was helping him a bit with setup, he made some progress now. 
look up for fanatec and think about that before buying trustmaster or logitech. i higly recommend it wink
 
[SMOKE]Date: Thursday, 2013-05-02, 2:29 PM | Message # 18
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Ok, I'll look into the Fanatec brand, it'll still be a while before I replace my wheel - I'm thinking it'll be September. Yeah Wayne's made some major progress in the last month or two - his 1st splits used to be 29.99 avg - now he can get 29.88 - 29.95 avg when he's in the zone! I know I didn't help him with that, so if that came from your help then Thanks! I love to see my best friend improve and I appreciate it buddy. The only thing I helped him with was his sc2 as that's my strongest area. He used to avg 1:07.00, now he can usually get 1:06.9x. As for his sc3 - that used to be his strongest area and he could allways land 26.5x, but the last 2 weeks or so he's dropped down to 26.6x or even 26.7x - I hope his sc3's come back to him quick because I know he's his own worst critic.
 
PectoRisDate: Thursday, 2013-05-02, 10:10 PM | Message # 19
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i just helped with setup, when i watched him and helped him with setup he never drove those times, he did 29.97 best and yes his sc3 was 26.7 all the time... his sc1 and sc2 are slowest actually when i watch him, those are the places where he loses half a second at least. he will do better smile
you have some reviews for pedals, fanatec vs logitech. that might help wink
 
[SMOKE]Date: Saturday, 2013-05-04, 7:02 PM | Message # 20
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Okay, I just spent the last few hours watching various reviews of wheels. I used to want a Thrustmaster T500 RS because it was the strongest, most accurate FFB and had pedals that were designed to be easily reverse mountable within minutes. However, there's one flaw with it - the large metal paddle shifters are static.. meaning they aren't attached to the wheel and when your hands are in a deep turn you can't reach the paddles without taking a hand off the wheel. That would present a problem for the XFG BL1 driving especially in T1. However, I understand why they went with that design.. The wheel is SO strong that if you let go of it - the thing spins back on itself with all the force of a tornado! So if the metal paddles were attached to the wheel and it spun like that you could get injured. It would be like sticking your finger into a ceiling fan on high - OUCH! But what they should've done is incorporate some paddle shifting buttons on the back of the wheel similar to the DFGT in addition to the large quality static paddles. That way you could use the buttons to shift without altering your grip if you wanted, or rely on the paddles if you were a drifter and needed to let the wheel fly around. For drifters, you wouldn't find the shifters anyways while the wheel is spinning that fast on FFB, also if you did touch a paddle shifter that was attached to the wheel spinning that fast - it would interupt the drift by halting the wheel's natural movement. So in conclusion.. if I were a drifter - I'd get the T500 RS. I however, am not a drifter so I will get a G27 or something. G27 is available at $250 now and it's extremely reliable and comes with pedals that have a clutch and are reverse mounting capable (sorta), a nice H-shifter and uses the same Logitech Profiler software that I'm accustomed to.I wasn't impressed with the Fanatec wheels reviewed considering the price for just a stand alone wheel. The Fanatec Clubsport pedals however are the best pedals around - so maybe a G27 and a set of Clubsports.  But at $250 for a set of Clubsport V2 pedals ... I dunno if I can afford 'em. For the price of just the clubsport pedals I could buy 2 DFGT wheels (the wheel I currently use), so I'd have a brand new one and a backup one for when the new one gets old. Or I could buy the whole G27 package for that price and that includes pedals and an H-shifter. That's the problem with simracing products.. the best stuff is soooo expensive. And yes I know "you get what you pay for" but I can only afford around $200 max when it's time to get a new wheel - probably not even that much.. I'll have to save or get help with the cost during a birthday or something. So that rules out everything except another DFGT or a good deal on a G27. I don't even know why I said I was considering a T500 in the first place. Wishfull thinking I guess, I don't have that kind of money! Heeheehee

Added (2013-05-04, 7:02 PM)
---------------------------------------------
If we keep talking about wheel's, we'll probably want to continue the discussion in this thread:
 
http://amgmotorsports.ucoz.com/forum/4-9-1

Message edited by [SMOKE] - Saturday, 2013-05-04, 6:58 PM
 
jackson9307Date: Friday, 2017-09-08, 2:02 PM | Message # 21
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Hello everybody,

Is there any theoretical date when the servers will return? I really liked racing here.
I hope I will drive on AMG GTi again in the future.

M@CI3K

P.S Don't hit me with that shovel I just used. I can't make new threads and I don't want to spam other topics.
 
SinDate: Saturday, 2017-09-09, 5:19 PM | Message # 22
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Hi M@CI3K, GTi and GTR servers are back online good

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jackson9307Date: Saturday, 2017-09-09, 5:47 PM | Message # 23
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Quote Sin ()
Hi M@CI3K, GTi and GTR servers are back online

That news made my day yesternight. Thanks!
 
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